CardersMarket takedown, details, and confessions
September 15th, 2007 by admin Posted in Credit Card Fraud
Ambersail pointed us to the story that CardersMarket has been castrated with the arrest of its top admin, Max Butler (aka Max Vision, Iceman, Digits, Aphex). If you did not see this coming I don’t know what to tell you.
For background information on Max Vision check out TaoSecurity.
To read the smack talk that Iceman has been having with El Mariachi of TheGrifters.net then read these posts, here and here.
You can read the remains of the forum here, but all credit carders have gone underground and can only be found on tiered and vetted IRC channels that try to stay as private as possible.
I just finished a week of teaching where I used a slide that profiled the face and inner details of CardersMarket. Now I’ll have to replace it with a different example.
![[del.icio.us]](http://images.del.icio.us/static/img/delicious.small.gif){kind=small}
12 Responses to “CardersMarket takedown, details, and confessions”
By SC Part II on Sep 15, 2007
The carders regrouped after 10/28/04. You no think they do it again? No matter how bad american police make things bad for american carders, the main carders the Russian will always keep it alive, waiting for their american counterparts to resurface for buying and partnering with each other.
By David on Sep 15, 2007
I know from very good sources that CardersMarket is not run by who you may think. In fact, the TJX story above is quite a laff, more of a PR stunt than anything else. Yes, we all know much of the leg work in cyber fraud stems out of Romania, but there is a whole lot more to this story. Will we ever see the real TJX hackers “rounded up”?The truth is, there were several
independent “hackers” who were in TJX, the ones behind the original break-in - can you say Keyser Söze - we’ll never see them.
Fun stuff though.
By Michael Dahn on Sep 15, 2007
I like your Keyser Söze example. Rarely does perception match reality. This is certainly what the media reported, regardless of fact or actual events. I think we need more media attention that reassures cardholders that their data is safe. Regardless of fact or fiction.
By El on Sep 15, 2007
Well, we saw it coming didn’t we? Of course no one else did, no one that wanted to let that cat roam out of the bag. I find it humorous that Iceman himself at one time worked for the FBI doing what he accused others so harshly of doing. His legacy will not be of that shining example of a good guy going down, rather it will be of a guy who flaunted his stupidity around like he was Mr Big while every LE agent in the world was after him. He lasted all of a few years and now faces the man. He also lost everything he had or would have had or made and he faces a large amount of prison time, which will be worked off as the Feds say, down to a few token months. He knows the game, and knows it well. The Feds love guys like him, they love to toy with them and then bring them back out to work for them. Then after all is said and done and damages reach into the millions they close him out and wash rinse and repeat with the next guy who wanted to be Mr Big.
Cardersmarket was an example in how a board is brought up and put into play, and then closed out as if it never happened. You can easily see the shades of the past written all over it, with the notable exception of playing hurrah at the end. This time the board was just deleted. In the days of Shadowcrew the board was left online for a few days and then deleted. This time the police deleted it after the announcement of Iceman’s arrest. Its easy to see the past being repeated here. Nothing left for people to read, nothing left for people to learn from, and nothing left for people to draw a bead on other unscrupulous admins and mods and other sundry people who worked in the scene to gather intelligence or gain arrests.
The reality is that there are many culpable people who bear responsibility for Cardersmarket. The hosting company who allowed them to host with them for over a year which was poundhost.com. LE for sitting back and using it as a tool to bust notables like Maksik and other less notables like Kaisersoze and even less notables such as Rayjack (Larry Hardiman) and others who ventured out into believing that it was all a criminal paradise and LE was just a small part of it. Lastly the security companies for living off of the scene while selling their customers on their knowledge, which was pitiful to say the least, and often given to them by the very people that lived in or around the scene as criminals.
Everyone made money and everyone still does to a large degree while a board is up. This is why there are boards out there now that already replaced Cardersmarket with new stings and new busts and new money already flush and waiting for the next round of suckers to come along to bite the hand that feeds them.
Cardingzone.org is the next board that follows Cardersmarket. CZ as it is known, was brought up by two other admins/mods from Cardersmarket, one is called Unauthorized, and the other nick is AccessDenied, both of whom started CZ a few months ago. It was when that board was brought up that others knew that CM was dated and destined for the trash heap.
LE/Security and their minions always bring another board into play for a few months prior to the previous one going down. This gives everyone a chance to see and hear about the new board. It also gives them a chance to grow. As soon as that has taken hold the previous board is brought down and everyone is directed by those left from the previous board to “GO THERE” by those who are directly responsible for directing the flow of traffic from one site to the next. These security or LE minions are always left out to draw in new suckers for the bust machine that is put into play just for them. Of course everyone benefits in the scene, from the Security companies to the Law Enforcers to the smaller people out there who are working compliance and other legal issues for merchants and banks.
So who is paying the tab on all of this victimization?
The victim.
Everyone is making a fortune off of him. And why not? There is a bleeding fortune to be made in it. So, boards have to be up for that to happen, because if there are no boards up, there is no information or intelligence to sell to those merchants or banks or customers. Thus a board will always be up. Because as there is a sucker born every minute of the day, there will always be enough of them to float around and get caught up in the tangled web of defeat on boards that they thought were real crime boards, which are in fact real but controlled by admins and mods who are LE or security agents.
The funny thing about them is that they entice people to get involved. They say no reading, no studying, only business. If you are here you must be vouched by others who you have been involved with so you can stay. This leads them to a database of associates. They also say no multiple nick names are allowed. The reason given is that there are rippers out there who use that method. Sure there are, but we have recently seen with the prosecution of the only scene person who ever took his case all the way to trial, that the agents working him were confused because he used 2 different nicks. CIAINTEL and PITBOSS. Those two nicks confused the Secret Service to the extent that the guy almost beat his case based upon their inability to distinguish his two nicks and their activities and who they belonged to even though they belonged to the same guy. The rub was that the guy let his nick get used by someone else once to send a message thus throwing the agents into a quandry over who they were actually dealing with, which caused quite a stir in court. So, banning people with multiple nicks is now the norm with the shady reason being given that it prevents ripping which is pretty false on the surface as anyone can rip, and many who have ripped were vested vendors who had been on the boards a very long time.
What multiple nicks do is give the upper hand to the criminals who can use them to obfuscate the reality of who they are, while LE who cant seem to tie their own shoelaces stumbles around trying to figure out who the multiple nicks belong to.
One can easily see just how things are controlled when one looks at the reality of the scene and studies it closely.
But, sadly, no one studies it enough, because all they are really interested in is the money. That is what LE throws out there hand over fist. They are the biggest buyers and the biggest vendors of everything illicit on the boards. They keep the money flowing buying everything they can get their hands on which further fuels the criminals to go out and do more and more crimes until LE gets closer to them wherein they end up springing the trap door open and closing it as rapidly as they can on the suspects.
Of course we can say this till we are blue in the face, but the reality is that until LE and security companies came along and got interested Identity Theft and Credit Card fraud were not very big crimes nor were they even on the public radar. But when LE and Security agents got involved, and to some degree saw the potential for money making that fraud had, it all of a sudden became a huge business for everyone and fraud exploded into the public view as a major problem. Now ID Theft and Credit Fraud are at an all time high.
We are all to blame, and all of us have a price to pay for those who are victims in this scene. We treat them as if they are the ones to be forgotten about, and in turn we use them as pawns in our own game of who can get to the top of the money pile the fastest.
I know I will never get there so what is the point of even continuing to try? It is not that I don’t want what you have, it is that I will never get what you have without doing something for it that usually involves being in the business itself. Much like Max Vision aka Iceman, he too had a record and could not get out from under it job wise. The skills he had mirror the truth of a wasted life who had tools but no legal outlet for them. For in the shit eating country of the USA there are no second chances for anyone. Once convicted you are a criminal for life. That is just the way it is.
Iceman had the talent, to bad he found it out late that talent means nothing without an outlet to use it. Therefore we all paid a price for Iceman being around, and surely many more will pay a price for him being around as the prosecutors line up to be the first to proffer him the best deal for ratting everyone he knew out. Of course he knows the game well. Be the first to make a deal and be the first to get special treatment. He will of course be given a new job because he will of course have the skills that every LE agent wants or needs, and so Iceman will be out amongst us again and in very short order. The problem is he will be on the wrong side, he will be in the hands of LE who cares little for the victims, and seemingly only cares about getting more money in the budget to fight the crime they allow to go on. That is the sad reality of the federal system, they let crime happen just to justify asking for higher budgets and more money so they can buy better cars, better equipment, and get more trainees in the system to help them. Its all a game, all based upon one reality and that reality is the darkness of money, and in that game everyone is as greedy if not more greedy than the person before him, myself included. So, before you say the door is closed on the carding world after Cardersmarket remember this from an up and coming book from the road of hardship and experience,
Lessons Will Be Taught No One Will Learn…
Peace
El
By Still ballin on Sep 17, 2007
As soon as something of signifigance happens in the carding scene El crawls out from under his rock and tries to bask in the glory and desperately seek financial aid for his “book”. Elsnitchiatchy is a hasbeen and know-nothing, former informant and he is wrong as usual. El just cant cope with the fact that everyone isnt as spineless, shameless and plain dumb as him. When El was busted he snitched out his russian partner, bigbuyer. But he didnt stop there, to increase his cashflow and to make sure he stayed out of jail he setup the stingboard thegrifters.com, the story of which was recently featured on wired.com.
BUT the alleged Iceman didnt rat on his partners in 2000. True he helped FBI with information regarding computer vulnerabilities. But thats not the same as ratting out your friends. It takes a certain kind of spineless bottomdweller for that. I quote securityfocus: “Court records don’t reveal what kind of information Butler provided the FBI up to that point - but his lawyer characterizes it as “periodic intelligence reports” dealing with computer security vulnerabilities, software piracy techniques, and password cracking, all on a purely technical level. ”
He did not rat. For further reference see: http://www.securityfocus.com/news/203 and http://www.securityfocus.com/comments/articles/203/5729/threaded#5729
No one cares about Els rants and no one will buy his stupid book. No one will even publishish it. Just roll over and die elsnitchy.
By jsadjajdsajdjs on Sep 18, 2007
What a ridiculous blog that censors facts but lets the inane ramblings of a crazy and sick man remain untouched. If anyone wants to know whether the alleged Iceman was a rat like david renshaw thomas of Montana you should read the securityfocus article regarding his case in 2000 which can be found here: http://www.securityfocus.com/news/203 and the alleged Icemans response to it which can be found here: http://www.securityfocus.com/comments/articles/203/5729/threaded#5729
By Decepgal on Sep 19, 2007
Decepgal, better get back under the blankets lest we find out about why you escaped Bankruptcy Fraud and cashing out at the same time.
I see you hanging about Decep, I think we should have a look at you. Bankruptcy Fraud, Cashing out. Hrmm, why you get away with it eh?
Let’s find out why.
In the mean time while we start looking you can read a small post about you below. Now where is that massive fraud case on you at?
http://cardersmarket.net/forum/showthread.php?t=9
By I SMELL A RAT on Oct 13, 2007
The web is constantly changing but David Thomas AKA “El Mariachi” (see insane rantings above) does not change. One minute he is a big time carder who created the criminal “carding” scene, the next he is a messiah who KNEW it was going t come crumbling down. When a board is up, Mr Thomas, who is a WELL KNOWN federal operative for the FBI (see his pathetic “I was a cybercrook for the FBI” story that a few sites with no self respect still have posted) goes underground and spends his days and nights quietly writing reports to various LE agencies and complaints to anyone who will listen about the target site. He snitches them out to anyone who will listen and does everything in his power to do damage. Once the site finally goes down or is taken down - up pops “El” to tell the story in his sickening, TWISTED way. Yup - he knew everything all along. He knew this was going to happen and he knew that was going to happen. Told us all along. The messiah speaks, but no one listens!
The REASON no one listens is because David “FBI” Thomas AKA “El Mariachi” is a pathetic, short, fat, balding little internet mind molester who uses every low life, low handed means possible to make himself THINK he is an authority on things. A very good EXAMPLE of his WEAKNESS can be found in his recently launched FAKE cardersmarket.net board. TALK ABOUT A COMPLETE FRAUD! Here we have a board that CAME UP within the last few days but INSTANTLY has TONS of people active on it 24/7! CURRENTLY: “Currently Active Users: 205 (45 members and 160 guests)”
This is all FAKE though! There are no 205 people on that FAKE server! I JUST FINISHED RUNNING A QUICK AUDIT ON IT, AND THERE ARE ONLY 3 PEOPLE INCLUDING MYSELF CONNECTED TO IT!
WHERE ARE THE “OTHER” 202 PEOPLE?
FAKE-FAKE-FAKE!
And this is what “El Mariachi” does. He is a total and complete FRAUD who will do ANYTHING cheap and underhanded to make himself look like he is important and knows what he is talking about. His new “board” is just one of MANY FRAUDS he has pulled off since being booted from the criminal carding world and joining the Federal Confidential Informant program. Now he has become if nothing else a PERFECT EXAMPLE of a criminal antagonizer. To see him as anything more is ignorance.
Yes, great wise El Mariachi. Another carding board has fallen. GOOD! But a dozen NEW ONES are already being put up. What about those? Every time a board folds or goes down, YOU take credit for it in SOME way! It is always THE GREAT EL who KNEW! It is always THE GREAT EL who TAKES CREDIT! As if ITS ALL OVER!
Every time, you ACT like you have DONE something and it’s ALL OVER.
But its not all over. And it never will be all over until the governments of all the countries involved get together and do something drastic to stop it. Rendering lip service to YOURSELF every time they DO accomplish something only shows beyond ANY doubt that you are a person who has NO RESPECT for the Law and what it stands for, but plenty of confidence in the fact that the gravy train will continue to roll.
By world dumpz on Mar 14, 2009
retcyvubin
By world dumpz on Mar 14, 2009
rtcyuiokpouytfghjkkoiuyvtcfg89jkooiuft6f7t8y90jhiuyftf678ty9jpoihugyf768t9yo
By world dumpz on Mar 14, 2009
we offer the best dumpz around email us
contact:
my email = WorldDumpz@gmail.com
By world dumpz on Mar 14, 2009
we offer the best dumpz around email us
my email = WorldDumpz@gmail.com